Lets talk about Nanoseers abilities. Nanoseer General

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  • SozaSoza Posts: 71Member ✭✭
    I'd like to thank all the nanoseers who are here to contribute to the growth of the nanoseer class. However it be that you are here to contribute. I'd also like to state that Id prefer we didnt turn this thread into anything remotely hostile. Keep your comments on the nanoseer class and not insulting other members of the class. If you disagree, describe why you disagree and nothing about the person. I didn't make the thread to have nano's bashing each other. That's what the mobs of starmourn are for. <3 each of you nanoseers.

    Interesting fun things I've seen. If you take someones INR while invisibile It seems to tell them what room it is in and not that it is in your inventory. Possibly a bug I havent tested it to the extremes and didnt have the logs of the person it belonged to. So if anyone is in the same situation to test, get back to me on that one. Happy hunting.
    MogarchePoetRonin
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    Darios said:
    My god you are full of yourself, and a bit delusional. And annoying.
    P funny that all Ronin did was agree with this comment and not actually say anything. 

    It’s clearly impossible to have a reasonable discussion with a few of you, so I’m not going to, largely in the same way I’ve had to block multiple people over Discord over doing nothing but spam and talk crap about stuff they’re completely ignorant about...
    Ronin
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    Atalkez said:
    That common denominator
    Those people should not be listened to who keep saying the voice of the people is the voice of God, since the riotousness of the crowd is always very close to madness.
  • XiruXiru Posts: 464Member ✭✭✭✭
    Well, that was a turn for the weird.
    Ronin
  • MarunaMaruna Posts: 371Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 8
    He's saying you're the problem, if you didn't catch that. Not others.
    Naturally I'm sure this is gonna result in you raging at me some more.
    Ronin
  • XiruXiru Posts: 464Member ✭✭✭✭
    I think I intercepted @Maruna 's reply. Otherwise I am sad. :(
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 8
    Maruna said:
    He's saying you're the problem, if you didn't catch that. Not others.
    Naturally I'm sure this is gonna result in you raging at me some more.
    Or perhaps the others are wrong, and stating that having more people makes you right isn't necessarily valid.

    See: Geocentrism, Flat Earth, etc.

    Not that anyone actually replies to any points I make... Instead they argue at me around them or resort to just name-calling and shit-flinging and doing literally everything they can to avoid looking at what is actually being said. Which says something. 

    Edit: For example, you accusing me of being someone I literally have never met, 'nor do I even know the name of, since you aren't going to give that to anyone.
  • RoninRonin Posts: 43Member
    edited January 8
    Wuff said:
    Maruna said:
    He's saying you're the problem, if you didn't catch that. Not others.
    Naturally I'm sure this is gonna result in you raging at me some more.
    Or perhaps the others are wrong, and stating that having more people makes you right isn't necessarily valid.

    See: Geocentrism, Flat Earth, etc.

    Not that anyone actually replies to any points I make... Instead they argue at me around them or resort to just name-calling and shit-flinging and doing literally everything they can to avoid looking at what is actually being said. Which says something. 

    Edit: For example, you accusing me of being someone I literally have never met, 'nor do I even know the name of, since you aren't going to give that to anyone.
    Her char's name is Maruna...just like mine is Ronin. you're the only one hiding behind a different forum name here, are you not? I've never seen a Wuff anywhere in-game, but everyone seems to think you are Awruun. Geocentrism and flat earthers societies(or whatever they're called) have smaller populations than the peeps that understand how the solar system works, unless you're saying the earth is actually flat and the center of the universe?

     As mentioned above, this is supposed to be a civil and productive discussion, I have been countering your arguments and I've been showing logs to prove what i'm saying as well in the fight club. You're more than welcome to post a log of why you think seer is weak, and i'm more than willing to help you figure out what you're doing wrong. I've mentioned this earlier as well but you've not contacted me for some reason, instead deciding to play the victim and "shit-fling" at the peeps that're trying to help.

    If you're working on getting into combat then delay, confound, and mindswap are gonna be your best friends and most-spammed attacks. Delay lets you...well, delay an attack, which also means their curing is delayed as well. This gives you a chance to double-tap with confound very quickly, dealing(hopefully) 2 affs and 4% subsys damage in a relatively short time. On top of that mindswap does 2% mind damage per tick as well, giving you even more of a boost towards mindmelt.

    You could be focusing on damage or eyestrike too much, and slowing down your progress on mind in turn, which is something I was doing pretty heavy at first as well. I suggest sparring other seers that've been doing decently combat-wise and figuring out what you're doing wrong, and as i mentioned multiple times now i'm more than willing to help.

    I also didn't reply to your previous comment because at this point I figure i'm going to be wrong in your eyes. Look at the likes/agrees/whatevers on the posts and you'll see that other seers aren't finding this class as weak as you're trying to make it seem.

    edit: ::smndb:: This person does not exist: Wuff
  • MinionMinion Posts: 162Member ✭✭✭
    Well, if you didn't present in such a way that you makes the admin out as idiotic evil overlords and the rest of as equally stupid, people might take you more seriously.

    There is a way to present information that doesn't make everyone feel as if they just got violated for having a different opinion. Don't worry, though, you are not alone in doing it. This seems to be a common problem.

    I personally agree with a few of your assessments but don't like to admit that because i feel as if i approve of the way it is presented. 
    DariosRoninsaturnine
  • RoninRonin Posts: 43Member
    edited January 8
    the problem/solution thing was a good idea though. Some of these solutions were already mentioned above, i can't remember names but i belive @Poet, and @Soza were the ones.

    I've also been working on adding nanotech and voidism to this sheet to make it a bit easier for peeps to compare our abilities.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bra4_KRK4QlTM9cWTCoOEVLSVIsFmUFwYsoBPJ0jwNM/edit?usp=sharing

    edit: @vekron was the one i forgot. Sorry mate!

    Problem: Nanoseer's aff output is too unreliable to get a kill off before we're damaged out by a decent combatant.

    solution1: Mindswap giving mind affs that don't overlap with confound, instead of picking from the same pool

    solution2: Mindswap changing sensory to mind as well as mind to other mind affs.(mentioned earlier)

    solution3: alternate skill that doesn't overlap but has a smaller aff-pool than confound(also mentioned earlier)

    solution4: Increase the Damage reduction of protect.

    solution5: increase confound's aff-pool so there's less chance of overlapping afflictions

    solution6: increase void's minddrain to 1.5% per aff instead of 1% per aff. This would make the skill far more useful at it's base requirement of 2affs, instead of matching confound's subsys damage, but without the chance of an afflcition

    edit:

    Problem2: Oblivion is way too situational and the costs are a bit steep

    solution: Decrease the sanity cost on some skills like timeline and swap

    solution2: remove the channel on interdict and distribution, and instead limit it to 1 effect per room.

    solution3: make the room-wide skills hit enemies instead of enemies and Allies, this opens it up a lot more for group combat.



  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 8
    Ronin said:
    Wuff said:
    Maruna said:
    He's saying you're the problem, if you didn't catch that. Not others.
    Naturally I'm sure this is gonna result in you raging at me some more.
    Or perhaps the others are wrong, and stating that having more people makes you right isn't necessarily valid.

    See: Geocentrism, Flat Earth, etc.

    Not that anyone actually replies to any points I make... Instead they argue at me around them or resort to just name-calling and shit-flinging and doing literally everything they can to avoid looking at what is actually being said. Which says something. 

    Edit: For example, you accusing me of being someone I literally have never met, 'nor do I even know the name of, since you aren't going to give that to anyone.
    Her char's name is Maruna...just like mine is Ronin. you're the only one hiding behind a different forum name here, are you not? I've never seen a Wuff anywhere in-game, but everyone seems to think you are Awruun. Geocentrism and flat earthers societies(or whatever they're called) have smaller populations than the peeps that understand how the solar system works, unless you're saying the earth is actually flat and the center of the universe?

     As mentioned above, this is supposed to be a civil and productive discussion, I have been countering your arguments and I've been showing logs to prove what i'm saying as well in the fight club. You're more than welcome to post a log of why you think seer is weak, and i'm more than willing to help you figure out what you're doing wrong. I've mentioned this earlier as well but you've not contacted me for some reason, instead deciding to play the victim and "shit-fling" at the peeps that're trying to help.

    If you're working on getting into combat then delay, confound, and mindswap are gonna be your best friends and most-spammed attacks. Delay lets you...well, delay an attack, which also means their curing is delayed as well. This gives you a chance to double-tap with confound very quickly, dealing(hopefully) 2 affs and 4% subsys damage in a relatively short time. On top of that mindswap does 2% mind damage per tick as well, giving you even more of a boost towards mindmelt.

    You could be focusing on damage or eyestrike too much, and slowing down your progress on mind in turn, which is something I was doing pretty heavy at first as well. I suggest sparring other seers that've been doing decently combat-wise and figuring out what you're doing wrong, and as i mentioned multiple times now i'm more than willing to help.

    I also didn't reply to your previous comment because at this point I figure i'm going to be wrong in your eyes. Look at the likes/agrees/whatevers on the posts and you'll see that other seers aren't finding this class as weak as you're trying to make it seem.

    edit: ::smndb:: This person does not exist: Wuff
    I'm not hiding behind a name. This account was made before I decided on Awruun, before I'd even decided on a race or class. I'm not going to use my fantasy names for Starmourn, though some people have done that, and that's fine, if a little strange when I recognise their names.

    Geocentrism and the idea that we lived on a flat earth was "common knowledge" for centuries. People who said "Hey, maybe this isn't the case?" ended up being ridiculed or ostracised. Having a lot of people disagree with me does not make them right. If they're wrong and echo one another then they're wrong together, not despite the volume of voices.

    I don't really need help to understand the class and our kill paths. I get them, and I think they're kinda sub-optimal compared to what other classes have or within our kit, like a bunch of our other options. I don't think that we should try to make the best out of a bad situation when we can make things better for us. Call me negative or pessimistic. I prefer critical though.

    I'm not really having particular troubles in achieving what is possible within the restraints of the class. However, I have the foresight to see where we're going to have issues in the future, and think that it's best to fix them sooner when the foundations are less firm and the cast isn't fully set, rather than later, when things become a bit more solid and more disruptive.

    I imagine I'd get likes/agrees if I decided to play ball and keep up with all the faux-politeness and kept to passive-aggressively making comments rather being open about what I actually mean.

    I don't mean to make everyone else feel like idiots (and definitely not the admins, though I have to say, there have been some pretty questionable decisions made), and I'm not playing the victim. I'm pointing out the obvious. 
    Ronin
  • MinionMinion Posts: 162Member ✭✭✭
    There's a way to be a dick but make everyone feel like you just saved their lives with what you said. It's a skill I'm still trying to master. That said, I'll reiterate that I do agree with some of your assessments. Not saying you need to have a solution on every criticism but it helps the admin more if you have a suggestion to make something work better.

    Also, you are certainly not the only one that is coming off aggressive in this conversation. Don't feel like I'm piling on.
    WuffRonin
  • TyeTye Posts: 127Member ✭✭✭
    This is my favourite thread, and I'm not even a nanoseer. 
    Eukelade gives you a peck on the cheek.
    tysandr
  • SozaSoza Posts: 71Member ✭✭
    Tye said:
    This is my favourite thread, and I'm not even a nanoseer. 
    I feel like 99% of scatterhome have to be nanoseers. Bc the same thing happens in our city that happens in this thread :awesome:
    PoetRonin
  • saturninesaturnine Posts: 127Member ✭✭✭
    Nah, I can think of 4 others I know of, two of whom are in my dynasty. There's a ton of scoundrels.
    I play Slander.
  • MarunaMaruna Posts: 371Member ✭✭✭
    If you actually PK'd outside of a few Cosmpiercers in the first week of the game, then maybe people would take your comments about Nanoseer being bad seriously.
    So far you've provided literally 0 evidence in an actual fight, unlike Ronin who has actively been playing the class versus anyone who wanted to fight. Evidence > Hearsay.
    The fact you'd rather just sit there and pull the childish card of, "Everyone else is wrong!" rather than actually physically prove yourself right, says a lot about you.
    Ronin
  • SairysSairys Posts: 215Member ✭✭✭
    Just a small QoL idea, it'd be handy to have a way to refresh pointzero and speedup.
    Depending on how my bashing goes they seem to be ending mid way through on the third or fourth mobs but I can't just quickly refresh them til they're done.

    Maybe a traveller ability to reverse time a little bit for them? Could have a sanity cost and maybe require that you're out of combat if being able to refresh them might cause issues in combat.
    Avatar by berserkerelf!
    saturnine
  • AdrennAdrenn Posts: 5Member
    I will say as a pretty unskilled IRE player in general, Oblivion seems almost useless outside of speedup or frenzy. Even when bashing at a pretty relaxed rate (the only way I know how to bash) I notice the 15% frenzy drop. If I ONLY use that ability I'm alright but... really?

    I understand it's beta. But given that mark doesn't work on reynolds, I've invested over 1100 lessons into oblivion and the only thing I have to show is a mandatory buff to keep up with other bashing. It feels bad.. but not getting speedup.frenzy feels worse.

    Again, this for all intents and purposes I'm a noob, but it's discouraging, if nothing else. Also most of voidism feels meh (which lines up largely with what I see of pvp reports thus far) but suffocate almost makes up for it for the time being?

    They both kind of feel like Reclamation - which everyone (in my limited experience) said was better gotten AFTER other, non-class specific skills, and sometimes after artefacts. I don't think that's a good place to be.

    You all seem to have high level thoughts, just bringing a "younger but not entirely new" perspective to the table?
    PoetRonin
  • SairysSairys Posts: 215Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9
    There's a couple handy things with that lesson investment just the groupings split them up.

    Negation blocks the next incoming attack, ripples seems like might be handy if you group up with other nanos (ripple then coordinate to hit different targets), sunderer itself buffs nano damage.

    I guess my frustration is that making full use of all of that with frenzy is soo many balances between each fight if you're only using frenzy at the start. (I.e end combat in sunderer > swap progenitor > negation > channel off > channel conqueror > frenzy > sunderer start combat) but that many balances is generally more than enough to kill something appropriate for my level.
    Avatar by berserkerelf!
  • SozaSoza Posts: 71Member ✭✭
    Sairys said:
    Just a small QoL idea, it'd be handy to have a way to refresh pointzero and speedup.
    Depending on how my bashing goes they seem to be ending mid way through on the third or fourth mobs but I can't just quickly refresh them til they're done.

    Maybe a traveller ability to reverse time a little bit for them? Could have a sanity cost and maybe require that you're out of combat if being able to refresh them might cause issues in combat.
    On this note I also think you should be able to use frenzy even if you had any number of frenzy hits left as some fights leave you with literally 1 left and you cant refresh it unless you use that hit.
    Sairys
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    Maruna said:
    If you actually PK'd outside of a few Cosmpiercers in the first week of the game, then maybe people would take your comments about Nanoseer being bad seriously.
    So far you've provided literally 0 evidence in an actual fight, unlike Ronin who has actively been playing the class versus anyone who wanted to fight. Evidence > Hearsay.
    The fact you'd rather just sit there and pull the childish card of, "Everyone else is wrong!" rather than actually physically prove yourself right, says a lot about you.
    Repeating lies doesn’t make them suddenly become the truth. 

    Are ever going to tell me, and everyone else, who my permabanned and shrubbed alts are? 

    Or will you just admit you do absolutely nothing but talk shit at any given opportunity?
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 9
    Sairys said:
    There's a couple handy things with that lesson investment just the groupings split them up.

    Negation blocks the next incoming attack, ripples seems like might be handy if you group up with other nanos (ripple then coordinate to hit different targets), sunderer itself buffs nano damage.

    I guess my frustration is that making full use of all of that with frenzy is soo many balances between each fight if you're only using frenzy at the start. (I.e end combat in sunderer > swap progenitor > negation > channel off > channel conqueror > frenzy > sunderer start combat) but that many balances is generally more than enough to kill something appropriate for my level.
    Negation can be kind of ignored. It’s nice if you can apply it as a free buff before battle, but eh. Fury hits between the blocks, Nanoseers have our DoT stuff (and damage isn’t what we should be doing anyway) 

    Ripples will hit your allies, and if used hunting, will hit multiple mobs and aggro them into you. Nanoseer Damage is subpar too, so.

    Sunderer isn’t worth the effort and isn’t going to see much use other than Breakdown.

    Our best oblivion technique is to stay in Conqueror or Traveller then to cast Frenzy/Speedup every fight, alongside your two obligatory repairs.

    I might throw up some ideas to rework some Oblivion stuff.

    After that I’ll do Voidism and Nanotech, so people have a clearer idea about what I’m complaining about and how I think things should work compared to how they do.
  • MarunaMaruna Posts: 371Member ✭✭✭
    Wuff said:
    Maruna said:
    If you actually PK'd outside of a few Cosmpiercers in the first week of the game, then maybe people would take your comments about Nanoseer being bad seriously.
    So far you've provided literally 0 evidence in an actual fight, unlike Ronin who has actively been playing the class versus anyone who wanted to fight. Evidence > Hearsay.
    The fact you'd rather just sit there and pull the childish card of, "Everyone else is wrong!" rather than actually physically prove yourself right, says a lot about you.
    Repeating lies doesn’t make them suddenly become the truth. 
    What lies? You're probably one of the least knowledgeable people when it comes to PK. The majority of what you say is wrong, and when you're told that you go full REEEEEEEEEEEEE on them; having a productive discussion with you is like trying to play Lusternia without spending money. Can you attempt it? Certainly. Will it be a fucking awful experience? Absolutely. Literally this response alone is proof of much, I told you to provide proof and you went full spastic.

    Are ever going to tell me, and everyone else, who my permabanned and shrubbed alts are? 
    I'm not gonna get myself jailed for disclosing alts on the forums. Please stop flaming.

    Or will you just admit you do absolutely nothing but talk shit at any given opportunity?
    No, because unlike you, I don't spread lies. I "talk shit" to you because you who have an obsession for spreading false information about combat. And by 'talk shit' I mean prove you wrong in pretty much every thing you say.

    As for 'any given opportunity' - You can see my post history to know this is false, already. I've probably helped more people in the past 24 hours, than you have in your entire cumulative playtime so far.

    RoninDarios
  • WuffWuff Posts: 238Member ✭✭✭
    Maruna said:
    Wuff said:
    Maruna said:
    If you actually PK'd outside of a few Cosmpiercers in the first week of the game, then maybe people would take your comments about Nanoseer being bad seriously.
    So far you've provided literally 0 evidence in an actual fight, unlike Ronin who has actively been playing the class versus anyone who wanted to fight. Evidence > Hearsay.
    The fact you'd rather just sit there and pull the childish card of, "Everyone else is wrong!" rather than actually physically prove yourself right, says a lot about you.
    Repeating lies doesn’t make them suddenly become the truth. 
    What lies? You're probably one of the least knowledgeable people when it comes to PK. The majority of what you say is wrong, and when you're told that you go full REEEEEEEEEEEEE on them; having a productive discussion with you is like trying to play Lusternia without spending money. Can you attempt it? Certainly. Will it be a fucking awful experience? Absolutely. Literally this response alone is proof of much, I told you to provide proof and you went full spastic.

    Are ever going to tell me, and everyone else, who my permabanned and shrubbed alts are? 
    I'm not gonna get myself jailed for disclosing alts on the forums. Please stop flaming.

    Or will you just admit you do absolutely nothing but talk shit at any given opportunity?
    No, because unlike you, I don't spread lies. I "talk shit" to you because you who have an obsession for spreading false information about combat. And by 'talk shit' I mean prove you wrong in pretty much every thing you say.

    As for 'any given opportunity' - You can see my post history to know this is false, already. I've probably helped more people in the past 24 hours, than you have in your entire cumulative playtime so far.

    Ouch, people call ME delusional? 

    No, you’re a flat out liar with no respect for yourself or anyone else. 

    I’m not wasting time to argue with you, because you have no intentions of listening. You’ve done literally nothing but derail any conversation you can, as have your only friends in life. 

    Thanks, this is the last time I’ll be responding to you or even opening your messages on this forum. Your false accusations will be seen to soon.
  • MarunaMaruna Posts: 371Member ✭✭✭
    Thank you for proving my point.
    RoninDarios
  • CrixCrix Posts: 3Member
    edited January 9
    Can someone shut Wuff/Remilia up before she spams this thread with NSFW images like she's done multiple times to IRE-related Discords? Thanks in advance for euthanizing the human drama elemental.

    Related: How does Nanoseer do wetwiring damage? Mind, sensory, and EM seem self explanatory, I just haven't seen the skill to do so yet.
  • RoninRonin Posts: 43Member
    edited January 9
    Crix said:
    Can someone shut Wuff/Remilia up before she spams this thread with NSFW images like she's done multiple times to IRE-related Discords? Thanks in advance for euthanizing the human drama elemental.

    Related: How does Nanoseer do wetwiring damage? Mind, sensory, and EM seem self explanatory, I just haven't seen the skill to do so yet.
    there's no skills to directly damage wetwiring. You'll need to damage mind/sensory down enough that they start giving feedback to the WW system.

    This starts at 90%, when they get the first subsystem-related aff, and increases as you damage their systems enough to increase the level of those affs.

    I'm not sure what sensory's is, but for mind it's Catatonia
    Crix
  • XiruXiru Posts: 464Member ✭✭✭✭
    Crix said:

    Related: How does Nanoseer do wetwiring damage? Mind, sensory, and EM seem self explanatory, I just haven't seen the skill to do so yet.

    I haven't actually played with this yet but @Ronin has. Check out the spreadsheet:
    Ronin said:

    CrixRoninSoza
  • CrixCrix Posts: 3Member
    Neat. That makes a lot more sense, thanks for elaborating!
    Ronin
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